Game Club Discussion: A Short Hike

[elf]

Now that we've had time to play (...and possibly, time to forget why we played and lose track of time because of NaNoWriMo), let's talk!

This month's megabundle game was/is (for another week) A Short Hike (itch.io version), "a little exploration game about hiking up a mountain."

Here are some potential questions to discuss, but you're not required to answer any of them. Feel free to make up your own questions and answer those, or just talk about what caught your attention.

1. What did you think this game was going to be, before you played it? What was surprising about it? 2. How far did you get in the game? Do you want to play more? 3. What was the central focus of the game, and what was on the sidelines? How did the sidelined parts support or detract from the central focus? 4. What kind of worldbuilding does it have? What questions about the setting were left unanswered? 5. Did you particularly like or dislike any of the characters? 6. What parts were most frustrating? What parts were most fun? 7. Did you use a keyboard, a controller, or both? How do you think that affected the game?

Comments

[packbat]

This was our second playthrough! We originally played it a couple years ago, I think - and then, we expected it to be much shorter and more linear. It was pretty delightful finding out just how rich it was with material to explore.

On which note, it was an interesting contrast playing it again versus the first time. On that first game, we were very much in a mindset of embodying Claire, whereas this time it was much more of a "let's complete a game" feeling. The writing continues to be wonderful, and I highly recommend on a second playthrough going for the peak with only seven feathers - it adds a little platforming puzzle that we didn't get to explore the first time.

Oh, and definitely recommend controller. We played it with keyboard this time, and while they do their best to accommodate it, it was clumsier. Especially during camera moves.

[isis]

The disconnect I had between expectations and the actual game is that from the description and the early gameplay, I thought it was going to be about the hike up Hawk Peak and adventures or interactions along the way. With that in mind, when I discovered that I needed at least 7 Golden Feathers, I single-mindedly went after them - getting money to buy them, doing quests with the hope that I'd get them, figuring out how to get to prominences that had them on top so I could gather them. I explored around the park and found interesting things, but I didn't do any of them for the purpose of doing them, I did them for the purpose of collecting Golden Feathers.

When I had 10, I was ready to "start the actual game" - and was surprised to almost immediately finish it! That's when I realized that the game is not "climb Hawk Peak", the game is "mess around the park a lot and do a lot of stuff and incidentally get these Golden Feathers and when you have enough you can end the game."

The endgame is cute, though a little strange in that the actual reason why Claire is at the park and waiting for a call is a little grimmer than I had expected. And you get to glide back down and see everything from above, which is fun. But - I felt like I played it wrong, focusing on the goal and not the experience, which, okay, I guess that was the lesson it taught me :-) Though on the other hand, I sucked at fishing, I sucked at the ball game, and I sucked at racing, so I'm not sure spending enough time on those to get my rewards would have counted as enjoying the experience!

I enjoyed the often very funny conversations; it was very different for me to play a game where the conversations are (mostly) not choice-driven. I also enjoyed discovering the flower trampolines!

I found all the competition-like things frustrating. Also I got partway through the poem directing me to a site but couldn't figure out the end.

I did use a controller on elf's recommendation, which I think was the right choice.

[melannen]

1. I thought it would be about walking! Mostly I was expecting it to be less objective-focused and more about just smelling the roses - I think partly because I'd seen people complain about that years ago. It is probably a lot less objective-focused than many games but I've mostly played very freeform stuff lately, so I'm probably coming from the other extreme!

2. I don't know how far I got. I have ten golden feathers and have made it I think *very nearly* to the top of the peak; I have enough money to buy a couple more feathers from the scalper which would get me up, but I'm being stubborn.

On the other hand, I haven't raced, I've barely played the ball game or fished, and in wandering around looking for free feathers I discovered an entire new archipelago I hadn't noticed, and a motor boat I can rent? I am not capable of predicting if the motorboat rental will take me to *another* whole new island or do nothing except let me pilot a boat. And I have a treasure map I haven't found the treasure for. Plus there's a hint there's another way up to the top involving going through the old mines, and when I try to go into the mines I just get a black screen, so I'm assuming if I find the right item, that will let me go up via the mines and there's a whole 'explore the mines' bit I haven't even started? But I am not sure, maybe that's just a red herring. And there's a bunch of items I have and haven't used, and I only just figured out how to make the bouncy flowers go and there's a bunch of them I haven't tried either, so maybe there's even more map I can get to with that?

3. See above. Though one thing that has always bothered me about "adventure" type games is that they often start you out with a fairly pressing objective! At least here it's just "get phone reception", not, say "defeat the evil dragon". But then they design the game to steer you into doing a lot of wandering around and wasting time. I know some more serious gamers make a joke about actively avoiding the mainquest, but even in a game this simple, it seems like if you roleplay enough to actually have some urgency about getting the phone call, you miss the game. It would be just as easy to set up the game with a "finish" that there's no reason to rush toward. Or in this game, even keep the same objective, but make it more clear that your character is looking for excuses to avoid the phone call and you-the-player is helping them! I role-played that anyway but I think I would have enjoyed the play more if I hadn't worried that screwing around on the island was going to make me miss a deadline.

4. I liked the island and I think there was about the right amount of worldbuilding, and it was well parcelled out! Although since I haven't got to endgame I don't really know.

5. The characters were all fun! Although another thing that I never liked about this style of game is that you often have to be rude to the NPCs in order to advance the game. I kept going through every conversation twice because I didn't want to just walk away without saying goodbye. :(

6. See above and below. But also I do get frustrated when I can't tell in a game like this what I am and am not supposed to be able to do. I probably spent forty-five minutes trying to get my first golden feather (because I thought you only needed one!) before I realized I was supposed to get my first one somewhere else and then come back for that one. As I got a better feel for the game I got a better idea of what was and wasn't supposed to be possible, what things were meant to be puzzles and what weren't... but I'm still discovering things that I thought weren't interactive or accessible actually are, if you do it just right.

7. I used a keyboard. If it's possible to fly up to the top of Hawk Peak with seven feathers and a keyboard, I don't blooming know how. Even with ten I can ALMOST get up but I have to waste so much lift maneuvering awkwardly around that I think I would have to be 100% perfect to do it.

Also I assume with a controller/joystick you can go diagonally, but with a keyboard you can only go up/down left/right, and that not only makes it awkward it also feels just plain wrong on a map that's all about windy organic paths.

[althea_valara]

Okay, so I want to preface by saying that I'm a very avid video gamer, but much of my play time is eaten up with Final Fantasy XIV, which is not surprising since it's an MMO and they're designed to suck you in. FFXIV is an amazing game, but one of my goals this year was to branch out to other games, especially other non-Final Fantasy games. Even though I had that as a goal, I doubt I would have done so if not for the posts in this community. So THANK YOU for helping me achieve a goal!

Even so, I kept putting off playing until I saw this post yesterday. I settled down after dinner and started the game, and played for about two hours or so. I just finished it up today - it took about 20 minutes to do so! I hadn't realized I was so close to the peak. What a delightful game! I thoroughly enjoyed it.

1. What did you think this game was going to be, before you played it? What was surprising about it?

I knew it'd be about a hike, obviously, and expected it might be in the woods. I believe I did hear about some people having platforming issues with it, so I expected there might be some platforming or jumping puzzles. What surprised me though was playing as a bird. I didn't expect that.

2. How far did you get in the game? Do you want to play more?

I reached the peak! There were definitely more things I could have done in the game, but I opted not to. I wouldn't mind playing it again in the future and exploring more. From the other commenters I see there were things I didn't find, like the ball game.

3. What was the central focus of the game, and what was on the sidelines? How did the sidelined parts support or detract from the central focus? 4. What kind of worldbuilding does it have? What questions about the setting were left unanswered?

Combining these questions together since I feel what I wrote below answers both...

From the beginning when Claire was waiting a phone call, I got the sense she might have been waiting for a call from a therapist - i.e., I thought she was struggling with depression or other mental issues. This is probably me imprinting on her at least a little bit, since I have strong anxiety issues myself and have been talking to a therapist since I was 15. So I very much thought the game would be about personal growth - facing fears, getting stronger, etc. I think it WAS a bit about that, as Claire needed to learn to climb walls to make it to the peak (i.e., get physically stronger), and the getting there felt like it took persistence, at least on my part.

But those were my preconceptions based on the game's opening. I don't think it's entirely wrong - I feel the story is about growing up and relying less on others, at least a little bit. There's a literal "leaving the nest" line at the end, so YES. But the main focus of the game does seem to be getting to the peak, which the other things along the way mere side quests. I liked the side quests because they helped flesh out the kind of character Claire was, and some of them helped with the main goal of the game. For instance, I traded the toy shovel to get a regular shovel, which I used to dig up coins, and that helped me afford feathers.

5. Did you particularly like or dislike any of the characters?

Well, I failed to find 15 shells for the shell person, and didn't really like the character because they didn't give a reason for it, just ordered us to do it. Otherwise, I liked the characters I met.

6. What parts were most frustrating? What parts were most fun?

There's a chest on top of a tower that was frustrating for me to get for a while, because I didn't have enough feathers. I really wanted it because I figured it'd either contain a feather or a lot of money so I could buy more. I eventually managed to get 2 more feathers via other means and was able to get the chest.

I also found climbing the actual peak to be kind of tricky - it got tedious enough that I turned off the game last night. I was surprised at how quickly I finished up today, though, after getting another feather.

Most fun: just exploring and finding all the things you could do.

7. Did you use a keyboard, a controller, or both? How do you think that affected the game?

I used my PlayStation 4 controller, and it's the reason I finished the game today, actually - too much of a pain to swap it back and forth between computer and console, so I made sure to finish the game (I'm streaming on Twitch tonight from my PS4, so will need the controller for that later.) I know for sure I would not have as much success with the game if I played with keyboard. I'm not great at keyboard commands, so I'm really glad I had a controller I could use.

[isis]

Huh, I very quickly figured out I was supposed to get a golden feather (the only one I needed...) from the park gift shop, but then discovered I needed MORE...

I think the controller definitely makes this a little easier, but I still couldn't manage either the ball game or the race.

[melannen]

I didn't have enough coins the first time I stopped by the shop at the park, and I saw the one on the rock behind the shop right after, and since the ranger was kind of discouraging about buying them I figured that was the one I was supposed to get. And I got SO CLOSE enough times that it seemed like getting up there really was supposed to be a puzzle to solve, and got frustrated and stopped playing. And then I saw in a post on this comm that you were supposed to get *more than one* feather and realized I was probably supposed to get them both, so I went coin-hunting, bought one, and once I had one the second one was easy. But if I hadn't gotten that hint I probably would have quit.

I did OK enough on the ball game that if I really worked at it for awhile I'd probably get it, but it wasn't fun enough to be worth it. I think the race is a lost cause.

[vriddy]

I did not expect the game to be this long or to reward exploration so much! It took me ages to "finish" because every time I told myself "Okay, I'm going to ignore everything and just go toward the Peak so I finish in time to talk about it on the comm," I would end up noticing a new area from above and I couldn't help going to have a look.

I did reach the Peak and it was a sweet ending (going back to the nap), although I wish I had spent more time on some side-quests, especially the painter person or more treasure maps. Realistically though, I probably wouldn't have finished those quests either so it's just as well that I pushed myself to finish so I could participate in this post before 2023!! Haha. It might be a nice game to explore again during a quiet holiday. I'm glad I got those 15 shells while getting lost a dozen times because I think I would have kept wondering about it otherwise 😂

I was also kind of impressed and often happily surprised by the dialogue choices. The NPCs often had a lot of personality or unexpected depth presented in funny ways (like the slightly rough person selling feathers at twice the price close to the Peak! Chatting with them more was interesting.)

I ended up using a controller as per the advice (really struggled with climbing without it) although the A/B/Z/etc suggestions don't match my cheap no-name controller so I was perpetually confused, but it was rarely all that much of an issue.

Really happy I finally got to play it (it was recommended to me before!) and how rich and wide the world is! I didn't expect the game to be this long, and I didn't even finish exploring everything and talking to everyone.

[vriddy]

It is such an unexpectedly rich game! I think I'd like to play it again at a more relaxed pace when I have some quiet time, there are some places I didn't explore as much as I would have liked. I doubt I'd try to "complete" it as I'm terrible at things like races, but at least discovering most of the places would be nice.

[vriddy]

When I had 10, I was ready to "start the actual game" - and was surprised to almost immediately finish it!

Oh, that must have been a shock 😂 From the moment the path breaks into two options at the beginning, my "EXPLORATION TIME" brain turned on so I didn't get too mentally stuck on the main quest and had quite a good time. It'd be nice to explore again someday.

I really enjoyed the conversations as well!! They were nearly always surprising in some ways, it was really fun. For the competition things, I tried one race and then thought "nope, nope, nope" and didn't try again 😂 It took me wayyy too long to figure out the flower trampolines and I only did toward the end. I kept trying to hit the plants with a shovel XD Definitely something I want to take my time with in a replay, some were in interesting places with no obvious ways to get water to them!

[vriddy]

I tried racing once, lost, and gave up. The ball game was fun but again, just did it once (I won!) and preferred to explore. The fishing wasn't my cup of tea either. I explored the islands around the motorboat a little bit but I shied away from taking the boat as well since I could see the post coming up soon and didn't want to get tooo distracted... 😂

And aaah I'm so curious about the mines, too!! I kept wondering if I'd missed a quest where you get a light or something to figure out what blocks it? Definitely something I'd like to poke around more if I replay, secret passages are fun. Unlike you, I decided to buy the extra feathers I needed, haha, I was just stuck flying below the Peak otherwise (but ended up finding a bunch of treasure chests and coins doing that, so I had enough to buy these feathers in the end!)

I got a controller for the diagonal moving reason you mention. I was struggling way too much with that first climbing tutorial at the very start without it.

[vriddy]

I'm so impressed you managed to finish it so quickly 😂 I spent so many hours just walking and flying and swimming around, but I'm pretty slow XD

[althea_valara]

Well, in my case I had looked it up on https://howlongtobeat.com which said about 2 hours to win the game and 4 hours to complete it entirely, so I think that might have affected just all I did in the game? Like, I might have explored more if I hadn't expected it to be so short. Even so, it WAS a surprise when I suddenly found myself on the peak, as that felt like it came pretty quick.

[elf]

I played once, for a few hours, with Kid the Elder over my shoulder for part of it, telling me bits of how to move around so I didn't get frustrated with it.

(I get frustrated with a lot of video games.)

Did not get to the peak. Plan to play it again and finish it; it was very pleasant. But I got busy with other things, and then there was NaNo. (I'm doing very well at NaNo but it's killing my evening leisure time.)

Did not even try keyboard. But had to dust off the controller, because I rarely play games that need it.

I was also pleasantly surprised how much game there was. "Short" is right there in the title, and I've seen a lot of games described as "short" and what they mean is "you can see absolutely everything in half an hour. You solve 1-2 simple puzzles, have a couple of quick interactions, and you're done." I had figured this was more than that, but didn't know it had so much to explore.

...I played the ball game enough to win one prize (which I have now forgotten what it was) but not the other one; getting to 20 pts was just too frustrating and I gave up.

I plan on playing it again later and trying to get a better sense of the layout, and of course, actually climb to the peak.

[elf]

Hurray for goals! I'm glad you tried it and enjoyed it.

There are so damn many fun indie games, and it's not even that the mainstream gamer news ignore them because they're not the AAA games (...sometimes that's the reason), but there are just too many to cover.

Hope you join us for more games! A lot of them are likely to be short; I expect the longest ones will be visual novels. (There are so many VNs at itch.io. So many. And it's hard to tell from the descriptions which ones are actually complete.) Since I'm picking games for a broad group of people with different interests, I'm going to hedge on the side of shorter, simpler games - at least in the sense of, "does not take an hour of prep & setup before you get started; game itself is not intended to occupy all your spare time for a month or more."

So for people who don't play many video games, they'll hopefully be pleasant; for people who do, they'll hopefully be a nice break from their normal habits without eating too much of their gaming time.

[elf]

I did not find racing or fishing (but intend to go play again and find them); did the ball game for a bit and gave up when it got frustrating.

If I do another game like this (errr... sort of like this? Because the plan is not to repeat things), I'd mention in the main post that controller is much better, and I'd post links to various tutorials/walkthroughs, so people could decide whether to use those.

[vriddy]

I also expected it to be a lot shorter, and it was really nice to realise that no, that island is a lot bigger than expected and offers a lot to do!

Congrats on the NaNo progress and good luck with the rest of November :)

[isis]

Hah, I did get into the exploration, but for some reason I didn't twig that that was the actual purpose of the game! Like, I didn't take the boat you can rent because I was saving my money for more feathers.

You can walk around with a full bucket of water, but you can't climb with it and I think you can't glide with it, either.

[isis]

I didn't even SEE the mines! And go you for winning the ball game, I sucked at it.

[isis]

Yeah, it surprised me to finish it as well. I had a pile of feathers, though, so it wasn't too hard to climb the peak once I got enough.

[isis]

I think the peak is sort of not the point :-)

[isis]

I agree that the NPCs were full of personality and kind of funny!

[melannen]

I got a controller for Christmas and the difference in difficulty is huge! I was able to make the very last climb that I had struggled and failed with immediately and easily with the controller.

Also this game seems like it's a really good one to get confident with the controller with, so I'm going to keep playing around I think. Nearly everybody seems to have a different dialogue once you've been up to the peak, and at least some of them will go back up to the peak with you, which is fun!

But I think I wouldn't recommend it without a controller.